Breaking the Mold: A Law Enforcement Veteran’s Journey to Wellness

This is Dr. Jana Price-Sharps Welcome to Mind Pilot. I'm very excited. We have a wonderful guest here today. And his name is Robert Nevarez. He is worked in law enforcement his entire career.*INTRO SONG* I'm going to let him do a more detailed introduction, and then we're going to launch into wellness and how he discovered wellness. And now he lives very much a life that he incorporates wellness techniques throughout throughout his life. So thank you so much, Robert, for joining us today. It's my pleasure Jana, how are you? I am great. I'm glad to have you on. You and I have done a lot of wellness stuff together over the years, so can you give them a little bit of description of what you've done in your career, please? Oh, absolutely. My pleasure. Well, I started in law enforcement at the tender age of 21 at the Fresno Police Department. I was still in college. My plan was to test and see how the process went. And they went hire me. And 32 years later, I retired from the Fresno Police Department. It was a great, great career. Started off on patrol. I worked undercover narcotics. I was on a SWAT team. I did all the fun things. And then I started promoting was a deputy chief at the age of 38, and I ended up serving as a deputy chief nearly half of my career, 15 and a half years of the 32 years I spent in the number two position. I retired in 2018 and became the police chief in the city of Delano about 54,000 people just south of Fresno, and I retired from there in July, almost a year ago, and about three months ago I took a position as the training coordinator for police de-escalation for the Western United States and something that I'm enjoying a lot and allows me to stay involved in law enforcement without the added pressures of being the police chief. So that's a little background on me and I think you and I met about 20, 20 some years ago now. Yeah, about 21 years ago. Yeah. Its crazy. Right? So that's me. That's who I am. Awesome. Well, you bring a wealth of information with you, so I'm excited to be able to talk to you about wellness today. Can you give the folks a little bit of background on on your upbringing and some of those lessons that you carried into adulthood? Absolutely. So I was the son of a mexican immigrant, very raised, a very traditionally very macho environment. I was taught as a little boy that little boys don't cry. I was taught, you know, suck it out, not to show weakness. But I was also brought up in a household that respected the law, and that was something that was deeply ingrained in me. And so I self self-directed, I think, into law enforcement. But I brought a lot of those beliefs into the arena of law enforcement. And later on, as I started learning what it was like to be a cop, I found that a lot of the rules that I learned at home related to how to handle problems and sucking it out, so to speak, actually blended well in law enforcement. I kind of fit right in. However, those beliefs or not the most accurate, they weren't true. And secondly, they weren't self-serving in the way of somebody that wanted to live a healthy, long career in law enforcement. So I had to learn how to really learn a lot of my beliefs and actually examine them and actually changed quite a few of them. Which ones did you change? Well, probably the most significant one was my minor, always in Spanish, because that's where I was brought up. hombrecito no llorón a little man. The term of endearment, little man. Don't cry. It's in reference to a child. But a child is expected to act like a man and they don't cry. And that was something that in in my childlike mind brought into adulthood, meaning that if I was struggling, that I wasn't supposed to show that externally. And again, it fit in with the police culture, because the police culture was the same. I learned I learned that lesson a little differently in the academy, but it was the same lesson, right? Basically, if you're struggling just shut up. Don't show anybody you're struggling and push through it. And like I said, it fits in well with the law enforcement culture. But again, it's not healthy. And at the age of 38, my world was crumbling around me. And actually a couple of years leading up to that, eventually it hit a peak when I was 38 and it forced me to to reflect and make some hard decisions about what was really true, about how I should be living my life. Absolutely. So what led you to getting into law enforcement? I think this is an interesting dichotomy, I guess. So I was raised in a household that my father was all about following the laws. I came from a country where you had to be self-sufficient. He taught me not to expect anything from anybody. I had to provide for my family. But in that same household, there was domestic violence. My father, by the by most of his life examples, lived a very exemplary life. But he didn't want to come, came to solving problems and challenges with my mom and so I witnessed domestic violence in my household. And I think deep inside I felt like this was an opportunity for me to go out and help people that were struggling with domestic violence and that I wanted to help in a way that I couldn't help when I was a young boy witnessing it. And I've come to find out because I facilitated peer support groups right after I was killed was on the verge of healing. I started talking a lot about mental health, and in these peer support meetings I found that there's quite a few law enforcement officers that have domestic violence in their upbringing, and I'm not sure if they are consciously aware of the drive towards law enforcement or something that happens more below the surface. But I do know that my experience has been that it's certainly not uncommon for law enforcement to experience domestic violence in. And then to answer your question precisely, I believe that's the reason why I got into it. Absolutely. I can I can see that it fit how you were raised and your your moral values and judgments and and mindset. You know, one one of the things that you mention that I think is so important is that so many men are taught that the only emotions that they can really have is they can laugh and they can be mad. They can be sad, you know, And and that's unfortunately a, you know, a chunk of life is sad, you know. And so what do you do with that? And and I think that it's important if you know, a person is a first responder, obviously, if you're responding to a critical incident or or some kind of crisis, yeah, you can't really stop and, you know, say, well, I'm going to go to my car or my engine or whatever, and I'm going to cry and then I'll be back in a little bit. You know, we're not suggesting that, but what we are suggesting is that it's a normal, healthy thing to do. And actually, when you're sad and you cry, you release serotonin, which actually is a feel good neurotransmitter that calls the system down. You know, now, if you're cutting hot onions or jalapenos or something, then no, you don't have serotonin in your tears. But when you're sad, you do. And so there's actually a neurological reason to to cry. It helps relieve the sadness. But again, you've got to be kind of aware of what's going on. So I think that a lot of your upbringing and, you know, like we said, I've known you for a long time, it helped you be an amazing officer and an amazing leader in your organization. But it also you had to come to terms with some of it wasn't working for you. You know. It wasn't it was actually it was destroying me. And I was in a really in a really dark, dark and sad place. And and but ultimately, it was that pain that caused me to become introspective. Without the pain, I don't think I would have I would have changed. Yeah, absolutely. There wasn't enough motivation. I want to keep living my life the way I was living it. I would have ended up divorced, probably in jail and ruining my career. So in a in an interesting way, I've come to really be thankful for my symptoms, and I view them now as kind of like a cause instrument panel. Yeah, you can drive a car really rough, which I was. And without an instrument panel, you don't know that your car is overheating right? Right. Years old. When that instrument says, Hey, you're overheating, you need oil. You don't curse the instrument panel. Right? Right. No, the instrument panel. You're thankful that you have it so that you can make changes before you blow the engine. And so now you know, people will hear me when I do my presentations, I'll say, you know, I'm really thankful for panic attacks. I really am, because it really for somebody is as strong willed, as stubborn as I was, Probably nothing short of not being able to breathe would have caused me to look at myself because by all external appearances I had less figured out. Yeah, I had a well under control. You know, that plane was headed right to the ground. But you know what? I have the instrument panel. I mean, I have the stick and then I felt I was doing a good job. But the truth is, I wasn't. I seem to remember a story where you had a panic attack and you were out to lunch with a bunch of officers. No I was at a training. I just go, Oh, you're just going for lunch. Would you like me to share that? Yes, please. Yeah. Yeah. I can't laugh at all of these now because they really in hindsight, right. They are pretty funny. But I just got done doing a presentation to 100 officers from my district and I was talking about leadership and some things that I'm pretty high, you know, high stuff, you know, related to things that officers to do to be better leaders and so forth. And we got done and it was time for a lunch break. And I was just milling around, talking and I didn't feel well. I really couldn't put my finger on what it was. I just didn't feel well. So I went to the bathroom and when I got to the bathroom, I could feel my heart starting to race and to the point where it felt like I could feel it coming through my shirt. I couldn't catch my breath and I thought I was going to die. I have this incredible impending doom and fear. And so what would a what would it be logical to do if in your mind you think you're dying, right? I was having a heart attack, right? The logical thing would be to reach out to one of the cops that was there. Right. Are all skilled in first aid CPR. I know how they can pick up a radio call for a paramedic, but now what did I do? I retreat into a stall to have my heart attack and not embarrass myself, because that was still the key thing that I was trying to to avoid was embarrassment not dying. So I went into the toilet. I mean, talk about humiliating, right? I'm in the toilet thinking I'm going to die. This reminds me of the last minutes on Earth, and I didn't reach out for help. It's absolutely incredible how strong that hombrecito no llorón You know boys don't cry. Later on the academy, I was taught another version. There's nothing you can't handle, right? You can't call the cops. You are the cops. I remember learning that in the academy, which further ingrained what I'd been taught as a little boy. And here I was dying. And on my deathbed, I would not reach out for help. Which is bizarre, looking back and funny at the same time. Well, like you said, it's funny now, but tragic at the moment. You know, thank goodness it wasn't a heart attack. You could have just died in the stall. You know. I could have been, but it got worse. So I went for my my and I said, hey, I'm not feeling well. And so he said, Why don't you just go on home? So as I drove home, I drove past the hospital and I had another one in front of the hospital. I pulled in and I had another one in front of the nurse after I'd already been hooked up to all of his monitors, to my fingers and my little stickies all over my chest. And it was so strong, the nurse was convinced that I was having a heart attack because you put a natural killer under my tongue. And so 24, 36 hours later, after going through a battery of tests to check everything that could possibly be wrong with me, I was released with a clean bill of health. Thank God. Right? No, because now I left. Thank you. All that heck just happened to me. Very angry. I was struck with this illness that would never befallen a man or a woman on this planet on the first one to ever have this thing, whatever it is. And it was worse. So, yeah, I can laugh now. It wasn't funny then. No. And very terrifying if you don't know what's happening to your body, right? Oh, yeah, of course. It's very scary, you know, And you know, one thing, I'll mention this later on, but, you know, the issue of wellness is it never ends. It really doesn't. And there are many times even now, you know, I feel that I'm very much healed and overcome a lot of that. I still get anxious from time to time, and I find myself still dealing with issues. But but I've learned I know what it is. And so I have a lot of tools at my disposal, at my disposal that I feel very quickly put into place and limit it at just uncomfortable and annoying versus life altering, which it had gotten to for me back then. Oh yeah, it can be very crippling. But again, it goes back to what you were saying. You know, our brain talks to us, but we don't realize that it's talking to us. So if you have knee pain, you're really clear that something's wrong with your knee. But when something when your brain is hurting and something's going wrong, it starts trying to tell you with a little bit of anxiety or irritability or anger or panic attacks or depression or, you know, it's telling you things are not okay and but what most of us are taught, I came from that. I'm a ranch girl. And so I came from that same kind of tradition of you suck it up, you know, you know, tough luck that the horse just rolled on. You get back on the horse, you know, we'll figure out if you have broken ribs later, you know, and and so I came from that same tradition. And and so part of that tradition is you just ignore everything. You ignore physical pain, you ignore mental pain. And, you know, if you ignore things too long, they get bigger and stronger and worse, you know? And so, you know, I agree with you. I think a lot of times people don't make those changes until it is really overpowering and overwhelming in life. And I think that's why, you know, two of my favorite speakers, Brendon Burchard and Zig Ziglar, both say, you know, embrace the struggle because that's where you grow. And when I first heard that, it just ticked me off, you know? But then when I got to thinking about it, I thought, you know, that really is where growth takes place is when we are hurting. And we finally decided, look, I don't want to feel this way anymore. I need to make some changes. I'm hoping that this podcast will encourage people that aren't at that point to make the changes before they get to that point. Yes, I agree. And, you know, it's interesting, the people or the personality types that are likely to struggle longer are people that are in powerful positions, people that are in positions of success and authority and chaos fit the mold for that of nurses. I do as well. You know, this charity presentations on wellness in a lot of different audiences, moms, you know, heads of household. You don't have to be wearing a badge to be in a position of power and to buy into the BS that you can't reach out for help or. Right. Or that it makes you weak to reach out for help. You don't have to be a cop or a firefighter, or it can be any of those things. And so, as I say, when I do these presentations to police officers, the applications, it cuts across to a lot of different people. And don't buy into the BS. It is okay to reach out for help. There's nothing nothing bad about that. Absolutely. Absolutely. But you know, you got to get the right kind of help. And we'll talk about that in a few minutes. But there's a lot of help out there, you know, And and you know what? Everybody deserves to have a happy life. They deserve to wake up in the morning and feel good. You know, you have to sometimes take action. So when you became a police officer, did it change your personality? Yes, it took a while, but it did. Yes. Usually. Want me to elaborate? Yes, please. I got a lot of stories. So when I came on, I was 21 years old, really naive, even though I had a lot of domestic violence in my upbringing, I still was a relatively squared away person. Did well in college, at least my last two years of it. Well, and, you know, I went to the academy and I was indoctrinated in some of the ideas and beliefs that I said, you know, there's nothing you can't handle. You know, you don't need to reach out for help. You can't call the cops. You are the cops. And I believed a lot of that, even though some of it didn't seem logical to me. I just didn't understand how a 21 year old kid was going to be able to go out and handle anything that the world had to offer. I but I took the Academy instructor's instruction at their word, and I found that by and large, that philosophy worked well in the field. I found that there was pretty much nothing I couldn't handle at work. I was very good at solving problems, and it was the worst that society had to offer domestic violence. I got to see that on a regular basis. Sexual assaults, child molest. And so and so my my world, although I felt like there was nothing I couldn't handle at the same time, I started getting a very dark view of the world because I was getting dispatched to 10, 12 calls, a shift where things have gone horribly bad. That's why people call the cops, right? You don’t call the cops when things go good and these people who were having a really bad day because when they call the cops were not easy to get along with. They were they were upset. They were angry. And sometimes they vented towards the police. So now my view of the world is covered with this dark dream or this film that now has me looking at the world through this, through this lens. And it's not positive. It's dangerous. And I started noticing things about my interaction with the world that were way different now. I was I was when I was at the mall, I was looking over my shoulder. I would rush my wife to get into the car. And and as I'm getting in the car, I'm looking over my shoulder. She's like, What are you looking for? I said, You don't understand. This is a dangerous parking lot. Did something happen? And she said, Well, yeah, I got dispatched out here three times last week in regards to this, that and the other. And to me that was a dangerous place. Although those three calls were not representative of that location. But it was wrong. It was representative to my exposure to that location. And so I started becoming paranoid, depressed, anxious. If you started seeing the road that way, you start to become anxious and my wife, I remember her telling me early in our marriage one time, she says, Something's wrong with you. You've changed. And I said back to her. I go, No, no, no, no. There's nothing wrong with me. Of course Something's wrong with you in the sky world where everything's the rose colored glasses. I've got a real view of this society. Well, the truth is, her outlook was way more healthy than mine. Now, mine may have been based on some reality, right? Sure. But hers was just a lot better for mental health to mine because I was scared of everything. And so that's a long answer to the question of that. I changed. Yeah, I changed. Changed a lot. Yeah. But, you know, I think you bring up another really good point is that so often when spouses begin to say, hey, you know, I'm noticing some major changes in you, so what's going on with you? A lot of times the first responder just gets mad. Yeah, I did. Yeah. And explains in detail that it's the other person's problem, not their problem. Exactly. Yes, I guess I was. I was. I know you're telling me that something was wrong with me. Mm hmm. Yes. So? Well, so what happened after you started to have panic attacks and think this is this is a problem? What did you do after that? Well, initially, my my symptoms, they started off relatively mild. They weren't that bad. I was just a little bit sad. Gloomy. What really sent me over the edge, so to speak, was when my mom got sick and my mom, I had a great relationship with my mom. I love my mom. And when she was 58 years old, she got ill and I didn't pay a lot of attention to it. It was, you know, kind of just a cough. And I remember getting a call one day. I was a sergeant and it was my dad. And my dad said, You're your mom. He told me in Spanish, I'm going to translate into English for your mom. She went to the doctor for a cough and they said that it's cancer. And I was I was shocked. I remember the blood leaving my hands and my feet. I felt dizzy. But that only lasted about a minute or two. And then I suddenly snapped into reality for me, which was there's nothing you can't handle. You can't call the cops, you are the cops. And based on my experience being able to solve anything at work, I told my dad, Hey, don't worry about it all. I'll be able to call him over there and I'll fix it. I'll help get to the bottom of this. Cause my dad didn't speak English, a lot of it. I didn't think he really understood what was going on. So I drove there that night. And the next morning we met with the oncologists and I didn't realize it was that severe. And the oncologist proceeded to tell us through my mom present that she had just a few months to live because the cancer had metastasized into all different parts of her body. And I proceeded to tell the doctor how full of crap he was and that I was going to I was going to do some research on my own poor guy. You know, I'm sure he has to deal with cops like this all the time when they get really bad news. And I did I did a lot of research on it, know when I got my mom some medications that I thought would make a difference in some natural things. And my mom was diagnosed in May. She died in August. And it absolutely it absolutely caused my foundation to fall apart because everything that I had built my life around was no longer accurate. Apparently there wasn't. It wasn't that I could solve anything because clearly I couldn't solve this. And it was the person that I love most in the world. My mom and that's when the symptoms started to get bad, Really bad. Well, it was a major shift in your worldview, huh? Yes, my worldview was it was obliterated, basically. Yes. So the symptoms were mild in this region. And it was you know, I got to acid reflux. I was kind of dizzy. I had a hard time concentrating my fingers were always numb. There is a lot of to kill your symptoms. I developed IBS, irritable bowel syndrome. But you know, I'm kind of proud of that now because I'm in the peer support groups. I just find that that's a very common symptom for cops. And, you know, did I reach out for help? Right. I got all these things going on. I mean, do I reach out for help? No, I still don't reach out for help because I didn't want to. I want everybody to know that I was struggling. So it got worse and worse. Yeah, but you turned it around. How did you turn it around? How did I turn around? Well, I'm a very curious guy. Like a lot of cops and although eventually I did reach out for help, the panic attacks caused me to reach out for help because I like I said, I'm thankful for them because nothing short of a panic attack would get me to reach out for assistance. But I still wasn't comfortable turning over the reins to another human, a psychologist. I went through six or seven psychologists. I'd probably drove them all nuts, and if I could see them all right now and apologize for being such a difficult patient. But I. I wanted to I wanted to be able to solve what was going on with me. And I was looking for a psychologist that was willing to to link arms, so to speak. Maybe maybe just kind of guide me by holding me, you know, around the back as I fixed me. And it was really a combination of me just reading and reading and reading about different things related to psychology, a lot of self-help books. And and that's how I started healing. I started getting some relief and I learned a lot of specific tools that were really helpful and help in getting me to change my mindset. Awesome. Well, you know, what is amazing is that you kept going. A lot of times people hit that bump and they or they go to one mental health person and then they just they, you know, they don't click with that person and they just stop, you know? And so which leads me to something that I just want to say to our viewers. When I first started working with President Police Department and and directly for DC Nevarez, at the time, I knew nothing about police officers. I had worked with a lot of addiction and a lot of trauma, but not specifically with police. So he and I sat down and had some really long talks about it and I said, you know, please send me mentors. I need some mentors because I don't know what I'm doing. So you assign me some mentors from, you know, one guy who was in patrol his entire time, and the other guy was SWAT and another guy was a K-9 guy. You know, just all kinds of different different guys. And most of those guys have stayed in my life this whole time. But initially, I spent a lot of time with them and became culturally competent. And there are a lot of clinicians out there that have never worked with first responders. They don't understand the stressors. They don't understand the different things that impact our lives or your lives, I should say. And so helping them to understand different clinicians are have different skills. And so if you first get to one and it doesn't work for you, don't keep trying. Don't keep trying, do keep trying. Sorry about that. And you know, and also ask them, have you ever worked with a first responder? Have you ever worked with a police officer or fire personnel or military? You know, do you have any background in that? Because it really does make a difference. It does. Because when we're you know, when it comes to helping a police officer, I think it's important for any professional to realize that they've got to go out in to the field tonight. And they you know, the mindset that I told you. Right. There's nothing you can't handle. You can't call the cops. You are the cops. Those things are are actually true at work. Yes. You can't I remember one of the first fatal that I was a DUI. Fatal. And the car was still on the scene and I knew that somebody was dead. Every fiber of my being wanted to to be sad with the person that had just lost somebody. But I couldn't. I couldn't. Nobody wants a cop to show up and start crying. Right, right, right. Those emotions off to the side and deal with the problem and arrest the bad guy. So they've got to go out and do that tonight. So So understand that when you're dealing with a professional, that that's either police, fire or military and they've got to go out and still be themselves at work. Absolutely. And that that's normal. So we were talking about choose your therapist carefully. And I know you had gone through a number of therapists and, you know, I think that you made a really good point when you said you wanted somebody who would walk through the process with you. I think where a lot of therapists go wrong with first responders is they want to be in charge. And since we teach first responders to be in charge, then you end up with a power struggle. And so it just doesn't work with a darn. So can you talk a little bit about some things that they did well and some things that they probably needed to change? Yeah, exactly. So the first thing you just mentioned, I want to go a little bit deeper into that, what I've told you, because Jana had mentioned we've we've taught classes on two psychologists on how to interact with police officers. We've done it at the Forensic Mental Health Association Conference. We did it up at the Anxiety Disorders Association and Conference. And then I think we we presented in front of about 60 psychologists, the Fresno Police Department, and I think we secured most of them. Yes, I think we did. But we had two police officers come in and talk to them. But, you know, one of the things that I always stressed with them is the most important thing between the doctor and the patient should be helping that client get healthy. And that's above being right. So I know that's I know that's hard sometimes because I think there's a natural desire to to tell because the psychologist, I get it, you know what's going on. You you know, you knew what I needed to do in order to get healthy, Right. But it didn't matter if I wasn't listening. And so so sometimes and I take my own medicine, it's okay to let that other person be right for the moment if that's what it's going to take. And obviously, I'm not saying to do anything unhealthy or or recommend anything unhealthy, but if they want to argue about something and act like they're in charge, for crying out loud, just let them be in charge. Because the overall goal is to them to heal. And I remember specifically an example of this is one of the doctors that I saw been in the business for a long time. And he said to me very bluntly, he says, the reason you're not getting better is because you don't trust me. He says, You have got to trust me. Well, I got news for you. You don't tell a cop that they've got to trust you. We're we we have a hard time with trust. And when you tell somebody that they've got to, they must. The hands up. I'm not listening. I never went back to that doctor again. Great guy. Very successful, well known in the area. But I think he just got frustrated and he just wanted to win that conversation. But he lost me as a customer and a client and I struggled for another year versus maybe have been okay with me, you know, winning that because the overall goal was to help me heal. And the psychologist that that handled me in that fashion just got more success with me. And I'm sure that they felt they were pretty excited when they could see that I was making some progress. And then I found that when I did go to the right psychologist that was more willing to link arms with me, that I would make some really fast progress by putting some techniques into practice. But I had to be willing to listen first. Yeah, well, and you know, I don't I've lost track probably several hundred officers over the years have said and fire as well. Fire personnel have gone to a therapist and they're I don't discussing a bad call and the therapist starts crying or says this is too overwhelming for me. One guy said, this is going to give me nightmares, so I don't want to see you anymore, you know, And, you know, and the worst one was, you know, the the therapist had a mental breakdown when the cop was with her, which was not good, you know. But it's truly, again, do your homework as basically a consumer, you know, who who do these people specialize in? What is their background? How long have they been in business? But also kind of interview with them when you meet with them and if that irritates them or turns them off and they get kind of snarky with you, that's not the right psychologist or mental health clinician for you in because I will freely tell guys, okay, this is who I am, this is what I've done. You know, if I'm doing something that isn't working for you, I need you to tell me because I'm not perfect. I'm not going to be a perfect clinician, but I do want to help you, and I'm here to help you the best I can. Absolutely. Yeah, I agree. And there's nothing I don't think it has to be anything overly critical. It's just that that personality type may not mesh with the personality type police officers that they're dealing with. So but the ones that I had the most success with were very common sense. Again, would give me a menu of things to do and when I when they followed up with me, they would check to see if I'd been doing those things. And if it didn't work, they'd try something different. And and then maybe that would have some success. So I, I really like that. And it's my opinion based on working with hundreds and hundreds of police officers over the year related to wellness programs. That personality style works well with the police officers. Yeah. Some of those techniques that they taught me, I still use them to this day. It stuck with me. And you know, you bring up a good point with the techniques you also need to find a therapist is walking the walk. You know, I am I'm a work in progress just like everybody else and everybody that works for me is a work in progress, just like everybody else. So, you know, we use the techniques that we're telling all of you to use. If you have a therapist that thinks they have it all perfectly, you've got the wrong therapist because there is nobody that is perfect, you know? And so, I mean, I don't go into details of, you know, this is happening and this is what I've done and blah, blah, blah. But I do say, you know what, I use this and it's worked pretty well for me. I've had other cops use it or fire guys use it or whatever. Military. And it seems to work for most people. But, you know, a therapist needs to walk the walk. They truly do. Yeah, absolutely. What are some of the techniques that worked most with you or that helped you the most? Well, the first one, eliminate negative people from your life. Yes, That was one that I thought I did a good job of, but I didn't. And I, I needed to be surrounded by people that were that were not only positive, but were willing to give me accurate, realistic feedback. And not just sit around and wallow in the mud with me. Those those people were not my friends. Those people just wanted to share gossip and really to give a rip about my wellness. And so that was the first step. Get rid of negative people and nothing personal, but I just don't want to spend time in their space. And it doesn't matter if it's relatives, it could be relatives, but you think are good friends. If they're negative and they're not helping you be uplifted, happy, then there's no time. Life's too short. And so that was the first thing. Eliminate negative people from my life. I just don't pay attention to them anymore and have them for years. I also chose to be intentionally surrounded by positivity. And I'm not telling you that I'm, you know, Pollyanna and I ignore that negative things happen. I, I don't I'm very realistic and I, I address problems as they occur because that's my nature. Right? I'm a problem solver. But I have learned that most of the things in this world are outside of my control. They're just things that are bad. Life is you know what? There's a lot of bad in life. I just choose to focus my attention on the positive, me focusing on dwelling on negative. All it does is just create negative thoughts and negative chemicals in my body that don't serve me. And so I'm intentional about it. And and in line with that, I'm also very mindful of my thoughts. I wasn't when I was sick, I was having a self talk, right. But it was helping me. It was happening just out of my awareness. And when I actually started to journal and I journal to this day, if I'm struggling with something, I will get up and I'll start journaling all my thoughts. Yeah, I'm I'm not amazed so much now as I was back then and realizing how much crap I was allowing to spend time in my head. Yes. And it's it's no wonder now, as I look back, why I was anxious because I had anxious thoughts all day long. Why was I sad? Because I had sad thoughts all day long. Why was I? I was angry because I was surrounded by a lot of negative people. And so I've learned to be mindful of my thoughts. And then somebody taught me this. And Janet, you've you have reaffirmed this over the years. I've learned that when I capture my thoughts, I write them down on a sheet of paper, and then I draw lines the thought and then replace it with the truth. And the truth doesn't mean that I'm just lying to myself. The truth is just the truth of what it is that I'm dealing with. And I have found that now my, my, my mind is a more fertile ground for producing positive thoughts or before it. There was a lot of manure in it, but it wasn't good manure and it was causing a lot of negative thoughts too. To take root and grow in my in my mind. And so those are some of the the tools that are very easy for somebody that's pragmatic to incorporate into their lives. There's nothing mystical or fancy about that. Most people can get their minds around that. And I did made a big difference. It makes a huge difference. You know, every time you have negative thoughts, your brain is releasing different neurotransmitters. You listen to happy music or you listen to a happy podcast or something funny and you're your brain is going to release, you know, feel good neurotransmitter serotonin, endorphins, you know, And and so you can you can use your external environment to really impact how you're feeling, but you have to realize you have that capability. You're not stuck with the mood. You know, I think a lot of people feel like, okay, I'm depressed, so I guess I can't do anything. No, no, no. There's lots of things you can do. It's very fixable in most cases. Absolutely. And there was one other thing I forgot to mention that was also key to be getting healthy. I, I made it a habit to take three mental breaks a day. And now there's an app, right? There's there's apps. You know, there's the calm app which I, which I used, but back then there wasn't calm apps right right. So but I was intentional about when I got to work in the morning, I didn't just dive in to work. I would close my door and I would take 2 minutes to to meditate or probably a little bit more broader. Maybe some people that may not be into that type of wording found that a lot of cops don't like to meditate, but they can't stop. They can't stop because that's maybe a little more embraceable. But it's in essence the same thing, just taking some moments to stop the flood of thoughts. And and in that the gaps of the thoughts is where I got to step in and take control back of my thought life. And so I did it three times a day. I did it at the beginning of my workday after my lunch break. And as I was getting ready to go home. And that allowed me a lot of clarity. So thought stopping or meditating, how are you wish to frame it? Absolutely. I try and take three or four or five minute breaks a day, you know, and it may just be listening to some happy music or listening to. One of my favorite apps is called Drybar Comedy, and it's all the standup comedian. So I'll listen to that for 5 minutes. You know, just something that takes my brain to a different place, that calls it down. And then I then I feel more ready to go back to whatever it is I was doing. Yep, absolutely. Yep. Wonderful. Well, any closing comments that you want to leave with our listeners? Well, so I'm speaking. So for police officers, another thing that I think is healthy and and police leaders can lead in this regard and I've been a big advocate creating as many positive events between the officers or firefighters or EMS and the community. In other words going out and meeting with your residents, the citizens of that community, when they don't need you under negative circumstances. And I'm talking about block parties, coffee with a cop and Delano on my last community. Café con Campesinos, boba with a cop. What it does is, one, it creates a lot of goodwill and positive interaction for the community. Yeah, but the other reason that I think is even more important is it's causing a first responder to go into society when everything is going well. Yes. And it balances out their view of the world. And in doing that, they're not taking that us versus them. They are we are them and they are us. And when you do that as a police leader for your officers, you create a foundation where there's less likelihood for officers to use force in circumstances that they don't have to because because the people are more relatable now. So and it's and it's healthy for the officers. So, you know, if you're an officer out there enlisting firefighter, whatever, and those events come up, realize there's a lot of positives for you in partaking in those events. Absolutely. And it it especially, I think, for law enforcement and military, it begins to break down the US versus them. Absolutely. Absolutely. So. Well, I'm sure our listeners will hear from you many times. But thank you so much for spending your Saturday afternoon with us. I think this is going to help a lot of people out there, Bob. So thank you. Thank you, Doctor. Appreciate it. Absolutely. So this is Mind Pilot. I hope you subscribe and please readers, this is Dr. Jana Price-Sharps. She guys have a wonderful day. Take care.